S6 TDi.... :-D

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S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by got desl? » Tue Sep 25, 2012 10:29 am

Just read about this on Jalopnik:

Fast as hell Audi TDi

Enjoy Dybz :sly:
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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dybz » Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:24 am

awww... little TDi's are calling on hybrid power to actually make them worthwhile to drive.
Hybrid > Diesel

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by DasTeknoViking » Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:55 pm

Read the article Prius guy... Nothing hybrid in there.

I guess my power electric windows make my car a hybrid too?

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dybz » Fri Sep 28, 2012 9:17 am

DasTeknoViking wrote:Read the article Prius guy... Nothing hybrid in there.

I guess my power electric windows make my car a hybrid too?

Using an electric motor to develop more power for an engine isn't hybrid technology...

:rolleyes:
Hybrid > Diesel

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by mp3dub » Fri Sep 28, 2012 3:51 pm

Dybz wrote:
DasTeknoViking wrote:Read the article Prius guy... Nothing hybrid in there.

I guess my power electric windows make my car a hybrid too?

Using an electric motor to develop more power for an engine isn't hybrid technology...

:rolleyes:


More twin-charged, less hybrid.
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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dybz » Fri Sep 28, 2012 4:17 pm

mp3dub wrote:
Dybz wrote:
DasTeknoViking wrote:Read the article Prius guy... Nothing hybrid in there.

I guess my power electric windows make my car a hybrid too?

Using an electric motor to develop more power for an engine isn't hybrid technology...

:rolleyes:


More twin-charged, less hybrid.

old 335 was twin charged. toyota supra was twin charged.

this is using an electric motor a la hybrid. sorry your TDIs are just not capable of making it without hybrid help.
Hybrid > Diesel

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by DasTeknoViking » Fri Sep 28, 2012 7:02 pm

its not making more power, its there to give you less lag. BIG turbo is where the power comes in.

There is nothing hybrid about this setup: no batteries, electric vehicle propulsion.

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dybz » Fri Sep 28, 2012 10:07 pm

power is calculated based on torque. the hybrid based turbo system powering the smaller turbo that prevents lag generates torque at lower RPM than the big turbo can spool up. this low end torque is what moves the vehicle at low RPMs. so in other words, an electric motor aids in propeling the vehicle... guess what an electric motor does in a hybrid? hint: helps propel the vehicle.
Hybrid > Diesel

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by DasTeknoViking » Sat Sep 29, 2012 1:07 am

There is nothing hybrid about it. Hybrids have batteries. Turbo does not propel the car, it gives it more air which is used to make power.
So once again since my throttle body has an electric motor opening it: hybrid by your definition. I guess all MKV and most Mkiv VWs are hybrids too. With no motor the car will be not making any power since it can't open the throttle to allow for more air to make the wheels spin in hybrid like fashion

You fail at this debate diesel is the shit hybrids are shit.

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dr Dave » Sat Sep 29, 2012 5:14 pm

A hybrid vehicle is a vehicle that uses two or more distinct power sources to move the vehicle.[1] The term most commonly refers to hybrid electric vehicles (HEVs), which combine an internal combustion engine and one or more electric motors.

For this to be a hybrid, take away the diesel fuel and drive the car. If you cannot, it's not a hybrid.
2010 Golf TDI ( Thanks Conrad !) 15.85@87.55, 10.21@70.3
1999 Kawasaki ZRX 10.87@126mph, 7.0@104mph, 146 whp
2005 Ford F250 4 door, toy puller ( Thanks Dad ! )
2006 Jetta TDI DSG
2011 Harley Electra Glide Classic/Street Glide
1986 Scirocco ITB Racer SOLD !

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dybz » Mon Oct 01, 2012 11:08 am

Dr Dave wrote:A hybrid vehicle is a vehicle that uses two or more distinct power sources to move the vehicle.[1] The term most commonly refers to hybrid electric vehicles (HEVs), which combine an internal combustion engine and one or more electric motors.

For this to be a hybrid, take away the diesel fuel and drive the car. If you cannot, it's not a hybrid.

did i ever say this was a hybrid vehicle? no, i only said it utilizes hybrid technology. guess what, it has a turbo that is spun from exhaust gasses and another that is spun utilizing an electric motor. either one can create a pressurized intake air stream to aid the engine in the combustion process.
Hybrid > Diesel

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dr Dave » Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:31 pm

Dybz wrote:
Dr Dave wrote:A hybrid vehicle is a vehicle that uses two or more distinct power sources to move the vehicle.[1] The term most commonly refers to hybrid electric vehicles (HEVs), which combine an internal combustion engine and one or more electric motors.

For this to be a hybrid, take away the diesel fuel and drive the car. If you cannot, it's not a hybrid.

did i ever say this was a hybrid vehicle? no, i only said it utilizes hybrid technology. guess what, it has a turbo that is spun from exhaust gasses and another that is spun utilizing an electric motor. either one can create a pressurized intake air stream to aid the engine in the combustion process.



OK Hybrid technology.

Cars with hybrid technology combine the power of an electric motor with that of a combustion engine. The electric motor in a hybrid vehicle can function as a propulsion mechanism as well as a braking mechanism which recharges the vehicle's batteries (regenerative braking). Both the engine and the electric motor can turn the transmission at the same time, and the transmission then turns the wheels. The electric motor can use electrical energy from the batteries to accelerate the car. When acting as a generator, it can slow the car down and return energy to the batteries.

If your definition of hybrid is to use electric motors to increase engine power ,but do not propell the car, not have regenerative braking, not have a seperate energy storage system. Then almost every car on the road is a hybrid.

Based on the above my TDI is a hybrid.

My TDI uses an electric motor to run my power steering, allowing my engine to produce more power to the wheels.


Do I get a hybrid tax break ?

:)
2010 Golf TDI ( Thanks Conrad !) 15.85@87.55, 10.21@70.3
1999 Kawasaki ZRX 10.87@126mph, 7.0@104mph, 146 whp
2005 Ford F250 4 door, toy puller ( Thanks Dad ! )
2006 Jetta TDI DSG
2011 Harley Electra Glide Classic/Street Glide
1986 Scirocco ITB Racer SOLD !

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dybz » Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:51 pm

Dr Dave wrote:
Dybz wrote:
Dr Dave wrote:A hybrid vehicle is a vehicle that uses two or more distinct power sources to move the vehicle.[1] The term most commonly refers to hybrid electric vehicles (HEVs), which combine an internal combustion engine and one or more electric motors.

For this to be a hybrid, take away the diesel fuel and drive the car. If you cannot, it's not a hybrid.

did i ever say this was a hybrid vehicle? no, i only said it utilizes hybrid technology. guess what, it has a turbo that is spun from exhaust gasses and another that is spun utilizing an electric motor. either one can create a pressurized intake air stream to aid the engine in the combustion process.



OK Hybrid technology.

Cars with hybrid technology combine the power of an electric motor with that of a combustion engine. The electric motor in a hybrid vehicle can function as a propulsion mechanism as well as a braking mechanism which recharges the vehicle's batteries (regenerative braking). Both the engine and the electric motor can turn the transmission at the same time, and the transmission then turns the wheels. The electric motor can use electrical energy from the batteries to accelerate the car. When acting as a generator, it can slow the car down and return energy to the batteries.

If your definition of hybrid is to use electric motors to increase engine power ,but do not propell the car, not have regenerative braking, not have a seperate energy storage system. Then almost every car on the road is a hybrid.

Based on the above my TDI is a hybrid.

My TDI uses an electric motor to run my power steering, allowing my engine to produce more power to the wheels.


Do I get a hybrid tax break ?

:)


the definition you used confuses hybrid car with hybrid technology. let's break it down further:

hybrid: A thing made by combining two different elements; a mixture.
technology: The application of scientific knowledge for practical purposes, esp. in industry
car: An automobile. (loled at this one)

in a hybrid car, you combine a combustion engine with an electric motor to drive the transmission, which then drives the wheels. in this case, we are utilizing both exhaust gasses and electric motors to drive turbos, which in turn increase combustion air pressure, allowing the engine to develop more power, drive the transmission, turn the wheels.

and yes, your TDI is obviously a hybrid. silly TDIs have been using a good electric motor to help them out for quite a while now that you point it out. no wonder they've actually been able to sell them :hmmm: .
Hybrid > Diesel

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dr Dave » Tue Oct 02, 2012 6:20 pm

Dybz wrote:
Dr Dave wrote:
Dybz wrote:
Dr Dave wrote:A hybrid vehicle is a vehicle that uses two or more distinct power sources to move the vehicle.[1] The term most commonly refers to hybrid electric vehicles (HEVs), which combine an internal combustion engine and one or more electric motors.

For this to be a hybrid, take away the diesel fuel and drive the car. If you cannot, it's not a hybrid.

did i ever say this was a hybrid vehicle? no, i only said it utilizes hybrid technology. guess what, it has a turbo that is spun from exhaust gasses and another that is spun utilizing an electric motor. either one can create a pressurized intake air stream to aid the engine in the combustion process.



OK Hybrid technology.

Cars with hybrid technology combine the power of an electric motor with that of a combustion engine. The electric motor in a hybrid vehicle can function as a propulsion mechanism as well as a braking mechanism which recharges the vehicle's batteries (regenerative braking). Both the engine and the electric motor can turn the transmission at the same time, and the transmission then turns the wheels. The electric motor can use electrical energy from the batteries to accelerate the car. When acting as a generator, it can slow the car down and return energy to the batteries.

If your definition of hybrid is to use electric motors to increase engine power ,but do not propell the car, not have regenerative braking, not have a seperate energy storage system. Then almost every car on the road is a hybrid.

Based on the above my TDI is a hybrid.

My TDI uses an electric motor to run my power steering, allowing my engine to produce more power to the wheels.


Do I get a hybrid tax break ?

:)


the definition you used confuses hybrid car with hybrid technology. let's break it down further:

hybrid: A thing made by combining two different elements; a mixture.
technology: The application of scientific knowledge for practical purposes, esp. in industry
car: An automobile. (loled at this one)

in a hybrid car, you combine a combustion engine with an electric motor to drive the transmission, which then drives the wheels. in this case, we are utilizing both exhaust gasses and electric motors to drive turbos, which in turn increase combustion air pressure, allowing the engine to develop more power, drive the transmission, turn the wheels.

and yes, your TDI is obviously a hybrid. silly TDIs have been using a good electric motor to help them out for quite a while now that you point it out. no wonder they've actually been able to sell them :hmmm: .


So then any vehicle with an internal combustion engine that uses an electric motor to boost performance ( not necessarily move the vehicle by itself ) is using hybrid technology ?
2010 Golf TDI ( Thanks Conrad !) 15.85@87.55, 10.21@70.3
1999 Kawasaki ZRX 10.87@126mph, 7.0@104mph, 146 whp
2005 Ford F250 4 door, toy puller ( Thanks Dad ! )
2006 Jetta TDI DSG
2011 Harley Electra Glide Classic/Street Glide
1986 Scirocco ITB Racer SOLD !

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dr Dave » Tue Oct 02, 2012 6:35 pm

and sorry for the thread hijack
2010 Golf TDI ( Thanks Conrad !) 15.85@87.55, 10.21@70.3
1999 Kawasaki ZRX 10.87@126mph, 7.0@104mph, 146 whp
2005 Ford F250 4 door, toy puller ( Thanks Dad ! )
2006 Jetta TDI DSG
2011 Harley Electra Glide Classic/Street Glide
1986 Scirocco ITB Racer SOLD !

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by got desl? » Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:39 am

Dr Dave wrote:and sorry for the thread hijack


No need for a sorry...this is actually fun and interesting
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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dybz » Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:16 am

Dr Dave wrote:
Dybz wrote:
Dr Dave wrote:
Dybz wrote:
Dr Dave wrote:A hybrid vehicle is a vehicle that uses two or more distinct power sources to move the vehicle.[1] The term most commonly refers to hybrid electric vehicles (HEVs), which combine an internal combustion engine and one or more electric motors.

For this to be a hybrid, take away the diesel fuel and drive the car. If you cannot, it's not a hybrid.

did i ever say this was a hybrid vehicle? no, i only said it utilizes hybrid technology. guess what, it has a turbo that is spun from exhaust gasses and another that is spun utilizing an electric motor. either one can create a pressurized intake air stream to aid the engine in the combustion process.



OK Hybrid technology.

Cars with hybrid technology combine the power of an electric motor with that of a combustion engine. The electric motor in a hybrid vehicle can function as a propulsion mechanism as well as a braking mechanism which recharges the vehicle's batteries (regenerative braking). Both the engine and the electric motor can turn the transmission at the same time, and the transmission then turns the wheels. The electric motor can use electrical energy from the batteries to accelerate the car. When acting as a generator, it can slow the car down and return energy to the batteries.

If your definition of hybrid is to use electric motors to increase engine power ,but do not propell the car, not have regenerative braking, not have a seperate energy storage system. Then almost every car on the road is a hybrid.

Based on the above my TDI is a hybrid.

My TDI uses an electric motor to run my power steering, allowing my engine to produce more power to the wheels.


Do I get a hybrid tax break ?

:)


the definition you used confuses hybrid car with hybrid technology. let's break it down further:

hybrid: A thing made by combining two different elements; a mixture.
technology: The application of scientific knowledge for practical purposes, esp. in industry
car: An automobile. (loled at this one)

in a hybrid car, you combine a combustion engine with an electric motor to drive the transmission, which then drives the wheels. in this case, we are utilizing both exhaust gasses and electric motors to drive turbos, which in turn increase combustion air pressure, allowing the engine to develop more power, drive the transmission, turn the wheels.

and yes, your TDI is obviously a hybrid. silly TDIs have been using a good electric motor to help them out for quite a while now that you point it out. no wonder they've actually been able to sell them :hmmm: .


So then any vehicle with an internal combustion engine that uses an electric motor to boost performance ( not necessarily move the vehicle by itself ) is using hybrid technology ?


it appears so. you've actually stumbled upon an einsteinian level development here.

EM * BP * IC = H

electric motor * boost performance * internal combustion = hybrid

and since internal combustion develops power, boosting performance

internal combustion = boost performance

so

electric motor * boost performance * boost performance = hybrid

EM * BP * BP = H

EM * BP^2 = H

and you guys didn't believe me that hybrid > diesel... silly dawid.
Hybrid > Diesel

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dr Dave » Wed Oct 03, 2012 10:13 am

So every vehicle that has an IC engine and an electric motor to boost performance is a hybrid, and since most vehicles do that, then most are hybrids.

Then what makes a Prius a hybrid and my TDI not a hybrid ?

Why wouldn't VW market my TDI as a hybrid ?
2010 Golf TDI ( Thanks Conrad !) 15.85@87.55, 10.21@70.3
1999 Kawasaki ZRX 10.87@126mph, 7.0@104mph, 146 whp
2005 Ford F250 4 door, toy puller ( Thanks Dad ! )
2006 Jetta TDI DSG
2011 Harley Electra Glide Classic/Street Glide
1986 Scirocco ITB Racer SOLD !

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dybz » Wed Oct 03, 2012 11:38 am

Dr Dave wrote:So every vehicle that has an IC engine and an electric motor to boost performance is a hybrid, and since most vehicles do that, then most are hybrids.

Then what makes a Prius a hybrid and my TDI not a hybrid ?

Why wouldn't VW market my TDI as a hybrid ?

you missed my previous comment. i was saying you've proven that every car that uses an electric motor that in any way affects the final power output of an internal combustion engine is indeed a hybrid. so really, your TDI is a hybrid. congrats! also, i am formulating a letter to all car manufacturers to enlighten them on this new finding and ensure that they change their nomenclature where appropriate.
Hybrid > Diesel

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dr Dave » Wed Oct 03, 2012 12:35 pm

no, using your definition of hybrid YOU have proven that most new cars are hybrids. Even old dragracers that had electric motor driven water pumps drove hybrid vehicles.

You used your definition of hybrid to prove that the OP's S6 post was a hybrid.

The big automakers still consider a hybrid vehicle one in which there are 2 distinct propulsion units with each having a seperate energy source. Typically to provide improved fuel economy.

So if we use your definiton the S6 above is a hybrid.

If we use automakers/governments/automotive magazines it is not a hybrid.
2010 Golf TDI ( Thanks Conrad !) 15.85@87.55, 10.21@70.3
1999 Kawasaki ZRX 10.87@126mph, 7.0@104mph, 146 whp
2005 Ford F250 4 door, toy puller ( Thanks Dad ! )
2006 Jetta TDI DSG
2011 Harley Electra Glide Classic/Street Glide
1986 Scirocco ITB Racer SOLD !

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dybz » Wed Oct 03, 2012 12:43 pm

Dr Dave wrote:no, using your definition of hybrid YOU have proven that most new cars are hybrids. Even old dragracers that had electric motor driven water pumps drove hybrid vehicles.

You used your definition of hybrid to prove that the OP's S6 post was a hybrid.

The big automakers still consider a hybrid vehicle one in which there are 2 distinct propulsion units with each having a seperate energy source. Typically to provide improved fuel economy.

So if we use your definiton the S6 above is a hybrid.

If we use automakers/governments/automotive magazines it is not a hybrid.

they're just trying to cover up the hybrid takeover. a lot of people are somewhat hesitant about hybrids... so imagine if all of a sudden they said "the majority of cars are actually hybrids." mass hysteria, planes falling from the sky, governments collapsing.

also, although it may be that i actually said that all these cars are hybrids, you were the one that pointed it out. i was completely overlooking the impact of the definitions.
Hybrid > Diesel

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by FVGNGN 1 » Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:33 pm

Huh?

By this definition every car ever made uses "hybrid technology". Using more than one technology or idea to optimize a product or system is the norm, not the exception, which is why the rest of the world uses the word "technology" to describe technology, and "hybrid" to describe systems that perform their primary function using more than one energy production/storage method.

It is all semantics, but if you choose to use definitions that no one else speaking your language uses, then you will be misunderstood pretty often.

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dybz » Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:35 pm

FVGNGN 1 wrote:Huh?

By this definition every car ever made uses "hybrid technology". Using more than one technology or idea to optimize a product or system is the norm, not the exception, which is why the rest of the world uses the word "technology" to describe technology, and "hybrid" to describe systems that perform their primary function using more than one energy production/storage method.

It is all semantics, but if you choose to use definitions that no one else speaking your language uses, then you will be misunderstood pretty often.

so... like... exhaust gas and electric motor?
Hybrid > Diesel

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by FVGNGN 1 » Wed Oct 03, 2012 4:51 pm

Seems like all that energy comes from one place. Whether you use mechanical belts/pullies, gears, exhaust gas or electricity, it is all technically "supercharging". It all uses energy from the IC engine to force more air into it.

I probably won't play your game very well, so I'll stop. The last sentence of my last post makes my point about as clearly as I know how.

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Re: S6 TDi.... :-D

Post by Dr Dave » Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:09 pm

Dybz wrote:
Dr Dave wrote:no, using your definition of hybrid YOU have proven that most new cars are hybrids. Even old dragracers that had electric motor driven water pumps drove hybrid vehicles.

You used your definition of hybrid to prove that the OP's S6 post was a hybrid.

The big automakers still consider a hybrid vehicle one in which there are 2 distinct propulsion units with each having a seperate energy source. Typically to provide improved fuel economy.

So if we use your definiton the S6 above is a hybrid.

If we use automakers/governments/automotive magazines it is not a hybrid.

they're just trying to cover up the hybrid takeover. a lot of people are somewhat hesitant about hybrids... so imagine if all of a sudden they said "the majority of cars are actually hybrids." mass hysteria, planes falling from the sky, governments collapsing.

also, although it may be that i actually said that all these cars are hybrids, you were the one that pointed it out. i was completely overlooking the impact of the definitions.



Also, using your definition of hybrid, which makes every car a hybrid, your claim that hybrid > diesel is incorrect.
If every car is a hybrid, then a diesel car is a hybrid which leads us to hybrid>diesel = hybrid ,and then, hybrid> hybrid, which cannot be true.

If we go back to the more recognized definition of hybrid as:

A hybrid car is a car which can run on two or more fuel sources.

Then the above S6 is not a hybrid, but you could make your claim that hybrid>diesel.
2010 Golf TDI ( Thanks Conrad !) 15.85@87.55, 10.21@70.3
1999 Kawasaki ZRX 10.87@126mph, 7.0@104mph, 146 whp
2005 Ford F250 4 door, toy puller ( Thanks Dad ! )
2006 Jetta TDI DSG
2011 Harley Electra Glide Classic/Street Glide
1986 Scirocco ITB Racer SOLD !

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